This is how a rudder post should be grounded, actually, MUST be grounded by ABYC code. Note the Green Bond wire from the rudder post to the boats Green Bonding system. No, the rudder touching the rudder stuffing box is not a proper contact.
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Running Gear, Props and Steering |
Updated:
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Coupler, Shaft, Dripless Bearings,
Stuffing Box, Strut, Rudder,
Props, and Steering System
Coupler Shaft, Strut and Rudder:
Struts, Shafts, and Rudders,
these items are made by Marine Hardware out of Redmond WA, 1-800-526-5971,
They prefer not to deal with the boat owner, they would prefer you dealt
with your local yard who in turn can deal with either Maxum or Marine Hardware
directly. Ken of Marine Hardware points out that they mold or strike in
numbers on all of their castings, please refer to them if possible.
James 2/00 If anyone gets a vibration and can't figure out where it's coming
from, check the bolts on the hubs attaching the shaft to the transmission.
All eight, yes both engines, could be removed by hand. That was just part
of the problem. Shafts that are found to be bent can be straightened by
most prop shops. biff@13-inc.com
Shafts, When measuring a shaft for replacement, measure from the face of the coupling hub to the bitter end of the shaft. Ken points out that if you only order the shaft your coupling hub will most likely not be true to the shaft. He recommends you either send him the old coupling and he will "Fit &Face" the coupling to the shaft to guarantee a true couple. The other alternative is to order the shaft and coupling hub together. PS the shaft part number is on the coupling hub, which is bronze, not steel, Thank You, way to go Maxum, those steel hubs rust something awful in boats and are a bear to work with when they get old.
Shafts, Your boats shafts are made by AQUMET, of Aqument 22, you can find more information on them at; http://www.aquamet.com/index/aqua22.cfm
Propeller Shaft Diameter:
A propeller shaft must be properly sized and supported, it is the conductor that pushes your boat. Too small of a diameter will cause shaft whip, vibrate and possibly shear, while an excessive diameter is waste of money and weight. The simplest rule is that the shaft should be at least 1/14 the propeller diameter. If more detailed calculations are required, an excellent book on the subject is, The Propeller Handbook, by Dave Gerr. Or propeller shaft sizing graphs can be found in ABYC section P-6. Dimensional Standards and Tolerances for Propeller Shaft ends, Propeller Hubs, Keyways and Shaft Couplings are in accordance to SAE, (Society of Automobile Engineers) Standard J755, and J756.
A note on propeller shaft straightness tolerances is in order here. From ABYC P-6 table III, for shafts over 15/16" to 8" in diameter, and with a length of over 4' to less than 8' you are allowed three thousandths of an inch tolerance. Table II calls out that for shafts supported at 42" where the shaft diameter is over 15/16' and under 1 15/16" the permissible variation is .006". Shafts 1 15/16 to 2 1/2" the variation is .007" these should be good numbers for most inboard boats out there today.
Rudders, speaking only for the 4600 SCB, the parts catalog shows the rudder as a part #65288 which is a 1&1/2" shaft, the shaft size can be verified by the 1.5 in the rudder bearing number and has a "9" cast into the rudder for identification. Marine Hardware sells Maxum 6 to 8 different rudders. Marine Hardware says: The easiest way to repack the rudder shaft is to drop the rudder shaft down while hauled out. On the 65288 rudder use 2 wraps of 5/16 Flax Packing, available at West Marine. For your exact information
contact Marine Hardware @ 800-526-5971 or Maxum Customer Service @ 1-800-824-2422,
or 360-435-5540.
Here's some thing to look for when on your boat next. Verify that you have a "green" ground wire attached to your anchor winch's frame. And verify that you have a "green" ground wire attached to your rudderpost. Most of our boats have the rudders "through hull" grounded but not the actual rudder itself. An alternative to grounding the rudderpost is to add zinc on the rudder. Because Maxum uses "high efficiency rudders" and the rudders are quite close to the propeller, I would not suggest this approach. Grounding of the rudderpost is the preferred method here.
Rudders,
The Rudders on twin engine boats, should be towed in, just like the front wheels of your car and for similar reasons. Rudders on twin screw boats should be towed in so that the rear of the rudder blade is about 1" further apart than the front. This will put the needed pressure on the rudder blades to prevent them from vibrating sympathetically and shaking your steering tie bar and in turn your whole boat. Some builders will toe their Rudder out, which has the same effect. How far away should your rudder be from your propeller? For a standard rudder 3 to 4 inches is a good distance, and for a high efficiency rudder, (smaller rudder blade) 2 to 3 inches. The closer the rudder is to the propeller the more intense the pressure placed on it. The further away the rudder from the propeller the less effective it will be. As your boat is hauled next time take your own measurement, and when down there look for any "burning" on the propeller blades and/or on the rudder. Burning would be an indication that the propeller is too close to the rudder. Rudders need to either be electrically tied into the boats bonding systems or have independent zincs attached to each of them.
Our Rudder Posts should be, but are not connected to boats internal bonding system. As per American Boat and Yacht Council Standards. ABYC E-2 2.5.8 "Rudderposts shall be cathodically bonded by means of a flexible conductor positioned to allow full rudder movement without stressing the cathodic bonding conductor or its connection." If you do not have a green wire from your rudder post you are using your rudder post and rudder as a zinc and it is being eaten away. Have a green #6 stranded bonding wire installed as shown below asap? Jc
This is how a rudder post should be grounded, actually, MUST be grounded by ABYC code. Note the Green Bond wire from the rudder post to the boats Green Bonding system. No, the rudder touching the rudder stuffing box is not a proper contact.
Rudder shafts and rudder tie bar: This weekend I brought down some 220 grit emery cloth and sent my 15 year old son down there to polish them up, wipe them down and seal them with corrosion block. They we pitting something awful. Take a look when you check your rudder ground bonding.
Dripless Bearings:
Dripless Bearings Shaft
Seals are identified by their flexible rubber bellows, and the
stainless steel color facing the transmission. Dripless bearings are now
being installed as standard equipment on our boats and are made by PYI
Systems out of Edmonds, WA. Dripless is just that, no water should be coming
through the shaft. The hose going into the dripless bearing is from the
engines raw water cooler and supplies low pressure water to the face of
the carbon bearing surfaces and cutlass bearing for cooling. For additional
information contact, Dan Schalk or Fred Hutch @ PYI or drop by their website,
http://www.pyiinc.com/pss.htm
PYI's Ph# 425-670-8915, Fax# 425-670-8919 or e-mail
dschalk@pyiinc.com. Additional information: if you own a Maxum with a stuffing box and have Diesels (a 2" shaft and a 3 1/2" shaft log tube) and you want to replace your stuffing box with a dripless bearing here's the scoop. Maxum has not changed the "shaft log tube" when they changed from stuffing boxes to dripless bearings. The PYI part number you need is 02-200-312. If you are doing this yourself or just want to lower your yard bill you will need two 15/16" open end wrenches to remove the coupling and a 1 13/16" socket an breaker bar for the shaft nut. You might as well have the (2) 15/16 wrenches on board anyway to check the couplers' nut and bolt for tightness anyway. We also needed to rent a Porter Power Hydraulic pump with a 2" throw pillow block to push the shaft out of the coupler. PS: It's harder than it looks but it's worth it in the end.
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Stuffing Box:
Shaft Seals, Stuffing Boxes, are used prior to and into the 1999
model year and are regular stuffing boxes and are identified by two adjustment
bolts facing the transmission. There may or may not be a very small amount
water dripping out of the shaft without the engine turning. "A small amount
being a drop every 5 to 15 minutes max". There should be a more aggressive
dripping with the shaft turning, "a few drops a minute". If you think the
dripping it is excessive you can adjust the pressure on the packing gland,
(when the engine is stopped please) by the undoing the (2) lock nuts and
putting additional pressure on the packing material. New packing material
is available at most marine stores, and should be inspected yearly and
replaced as necessary. Be sure to re-lock the locking nuts and apply even
pressure, "the same small increments of turning" to both sides. The 5 1/2"
long 3 1/2" diameter hose connects the shaft log and the stuffing box on
boats with a 2" shaft. The hose going into the stuffing box is from
the engines is from the engine's raw water cooler and it supplies low pressure
water into the packing gland and the water exits via the cutlass bearing
surfaces through the shaft log for it’s cooling. When you can no longer
control the flow of water by adjustment it is time to re-pack the stuffing
box. Maxum says to use a pick and remove what is left of the old
material and install new 3/16" material and wrap it 4 times around the
shaft. This is good for the 1 & 1/2 ' shafts as well as the 2" shafts. Your Stuffing box was made by Marine Hardware, POB 3099, Redmond, WA 98073-3099 1-800-526-5971.
New information 8/2000: AFTER SPENDING ALMOST A FULL DAY REPACKING BOTH STUFFING BOXES, I FIND OUT THAT THE INFO WE HAD WAS INCORRECT. THE PACKING MATERIAL, ACCORDING TO MARINE HARDWARE (1-800-526-5971) SHOULD BE 1/4" (NOT 3/16") AND IT'S WRAPS 3 TIMES AROUND THE SHAFT (NOT 4) I USED THE TEFLON PACKING, WITH A SPECIAL LUBE ($10.00 FOR A VERY SMALL AMOUNT)
PLEASE KEEP THE INFO COMING! THANK YOU, DICK ZBORAY
More information: When my packing nuts came
off even with the lock nuts tightened I installed locking nuts with the
plastic inserts. Problem solved (4100 SCA w 1/ 1/2" shafts). biff@13-inc.com
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Stuffing box Shown |
Packing Glands keep the water out with concentric wraps of packing material around the shaft, compacted and spread with the packing nut. Sizing of the packing material, the simplest way to size the material is to match or slightly exceed the wall thickness of the Gland Wall's plunger. The plunger is typically 70 thousandths larger than the shaft to allow the material to be compressed into this space causing the shaft to seal. Material selection can be done via the chart below. It is important to remember that the Packing Nut must thread onto the Gland at least 4 full threads to reliably hold. Many packing nut styles and smaller propeller shafts 1" to 1 1/8" will only have room for 2 wraps of packing material, when 2 wraps are used place their cut ends placed 180 degrees apart. For shafts 1 1/4" and larger, I usually cut the packing material so that I have three single wraps that are the diameter of the Propeller Shaft. I cut the ends of the material on 30 degrees angles so they can splice into each other as they are pushed back. As I'm ready to push the three wraps material packing material back into the Packing Gland, I makes sure that the cuts are offset 120 degrees from each other and then push them back with the packing nut hand tight. Hand tight and a bit is about what you are looking for, too tight and you will burn out the packing material and you could score the shaft. If you try three wraps and cannot get four full turns on the Packing nut, you have to try again using only two wraps. The packing material could be as high tech as a FEP Flurocarbon-impregnated asbestos braid, non asbestos composite fiber with PTFE or as simple as a wax-impregnated flax. The packing material is pre packaged in lenghts of about two feet and sold in different diameters.
After usually guessing at your packing material diameter, and buying a size on each side of your guess, you back off your jam nut and release your packing gland nut, if your still floating, and I strongly suggest that you do this on shore, the water will now come in, quickly. You have to pick out any old packing before you install your wraps of packing around the shaft and seat it back with the packing nut, and then lock down the packing gland nut with the jam nut. Here views vary as to how much should it drip, and when? I set my shaft seal so that it does not drip when the shaft is not moving, I allow about 1-3 or so drops a minute while the shaft is turning. This has always worked fine for me, the dripping lubricates and to a degree cools the packing material, other individuals have different theories. So be it. If you insist on doing this in the water, please don't, but if you must, don't do it alone, and have a backup plan if everything fails and you start to take on water. Remember you were advised against it. Re check the drip ratio after running the boat for a while, the material is bound to seat itself and a "tweaking" will be in order.
Props:
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Above is a clear space to store your spare props behind the Port Engine on a 4600 SCB. The boards you see are treated 1" x 6" under the plywood, I use them for storage, I have them here and in the stern. This photo is of my boat after removing the stuffing box and replacing it with a Dripless bearing, thanks again PYI. 1/00 |
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Wanda and I, (Rod) just returned from a two week cruise down into the keys.It was our first cruise on our new 4600,and everything went well. Mounting of the Props was very easy and required only hand tools. The spindle was shaped with a plane and does't have to be exact. The taper will hold the prop snugly. The area is on either side in the aft storage compartment just behind the mufflers. Rod Day mailto:day1@mediaone.net 4/2001
More from Biff, "We're also re-propping (our 4100 SCR) in an effort to get the engines up to operating range. We can't get above 4200 WOT when the Mercruiser manual says WOT on the 8.2L (502cid, 400 HP) is 4900 with cruise @ 4400-4800. We are also going back to Maxum on this as well. I'm going to develop some performance specs before and after that I'll pass on to you at the end of the season. If any else has experienced this I would like to know, Many Thanks. 5/00 biff@13-inc.com or biff@13-inc.com There is more on this from biff in the props section below. 8/00
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Drift Key, cotter pin and shaft nut and lock nut. If you have a diver down below pulling your props and the diver drops any of the above your not going anywhere fast. That what I found out from Ray from Cape Coral, Ray has done over 8000 miles on the east coast and great lakes, and has gone through "a few sets of props, and shafts in our time". I was down at his place buying his extra set of props for our boat. For example, new Michigan 24 X 22 props cost about $1100. to $1350. each, and may not be in stock "off the shelf". When I was at the prop shop later that week I picked up a spare drift key, cotter pin and nut set for a 2" shaft for just under $50.00. I consider that cheep trip insurance.
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Coupler:
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Props, "The original props on our 4100 SCA, 23x24 SKU _ _ _ _ something, and are not domestic and are made specifically for US Marine. Michigan Prop has a similar prop but the forward shank is shorter. They snug up just fine though. Our original props were sent by an experienced prop guy in Sodus Point, NY to PESCO in South Carolina to be repaired. Even with all his tool and experience he couldn't duplicate the pitch and cup. We'll keep you informed next year when we put them back on." biff@13-inc.com when I've heard that our props were made in England, any other feedback? Yes they are. CJR Propulsion Limited, 72 Quayside Rd. Southampton Hampshire England So181AD Fax # 0114402380211832. F Hearold 8/00 Over the winter we had our new, spare props re-pitched 2 degrees to 22 x 23 from 24 x 23 and it's improved speed. This allows us to get 400 more rpm from 4200 max to 4800 max but still short of the manufacturer's max rpm of 5200 for the 400 hp, 502s. I haven't had an opportunity to check fuel consumption which I hope to do that before the end of the season. biff@13-inc.comProp Change Response: Jim, recently, we hauled our boat for a bottom job and at the time I took your advice and changed our prop pitch from 22 to 24. I am most happy to report that we have gained 3 miles/hour in speed. I am not certain yet, but I don't think it has increased our fuel consumption. It does take a little longer now for the boat to get on plane but that's a mild tradeoff in comparison to the 3 mile speed increase.
Thank you for all your info. It has really paid off and is greatly appreciated.
Myron Wang. The My Nicole. Maxum 4600 SCB ALASKANMT@aol.com
Props, Three Blade or Four Blade? Three Blade props give good all round performance for boats up to 40 feet, then you will want a four blade prop, four blade props will provide a smoother ride and are less prone to cause vibration. They will also produce better acceleration. Four blade props cost more than three blade props and to get the same top end you will want them highly skewed. Maxum has chosen to provide us with Nibral propellers, most of our boats are four blade and are highly skewed. Nibral is the material the propeller is made out of. Nibral is VERY hard and can give you a second chance it you run to mud or sand. If you need a replacement or spare prop and you want it exactly the same as original equipment contact your dealer or call Maxum.
Propellers for Sale to Maxum Owners from CJR Propeller.
I sent the following message to CJR Propeller, these are the folks in England who have supplied Maxum/US Marine with most of the propellers for our boats. http://www.cjrprop.com/
Hello, my name is James Clausen from the Maxum Owners Group. (www.maxumowners.org)
I am trying to verify the propellers Maxum/US Marine purchases from you so that I can relay that information to our Maxum Owners. I have the 46' Maxum and it was shipped with CJR 24" x 22" 2" shaft, four blade nibrals. They look like they are Ultraskew .75 DAR 75% Rake 0 Skew 28. Many of us would like to have a spare set, but don't know what to order or where to order them from. Can you help.
CJR responds: We do indeed supply the propellers to Maxum. We can offer these to you as you are an owners club at trade prices. 24 X 22 will be $1039 each hand less 30% trade discount, approximately $744.00. These prices are plus delivery costs of approximately $232.00. Many thanks, Mark Russell, CJR Propeller.
Mark, thank you for your prompt positive response. I have a few questions. Where would the props be shipped from? Answer, England.
I suppose most of our members would prefer to pay via Visa or Master Card, is this possible? Answer, Yes.
Is the Ultraskew . 75 DAR 75% Rake 0 Skew 28 the prop Maxum/US Marine buys? Answer, Yes.
And finally, should members contact you directly? Answer, Yes, contact mark@cjrprop.com mention Maxumowners Group, 30% discount, identify your boat model and prop size. If you don't know your prop size look it up @ http://www.maxumboatparts.com
Keep in touch and let me know how you make out and if you decide to order a set 11/15/2001 and they are GREAT. Mark has given us a great opportunity here at a great price.
Order as follows: Change your Blade Diameter, Pitch and Shaft Diameter to suit your needs:
CJR 4 blade NIBRL Ultraskew .75 - DAR 75% - Rake 0 - Skew 28
24" Blade Diameter
22" Pitch
2" Shaft Diameter
Taper per standard SAE J755 and SAE J756
Taper Length per standard SAE J755 and SAE J756
Same as were sold to US Marine in 1998- 1999- 2000
At CJR we look forward to hearing from other members.
Contact Mark Russell, or Andy Pickin of CJR Propeller.
CJR Propulsion Ltd
70-72 Quayside Road
Bitterne Manor Southampton
S018 1AD United Kingdom
Tel: from the USA
011 +44 23 8063 9366 or 011 +44 23 8022 2032
http://www.cjrprop.com/company.html
E-Mail: info@cjrprop.com support@cjrprop.com
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Steering System:
Steering System.
B Grey found that on our first time out leaving the slip, "We couldn't get the port engine gear shifter to get out of forward. The set screw wasn't tightened down so the shift handle was slipping on the knurled shaft. Could only make right turns and was pretty exciting until I could get out the allen wrench. Lock Tite and tighten both shifters and the throttles while your at it. If this happens when backing into a slip, it would be very serious. B Grey. 7/99 Did I tell you that we lost steering last year when the hull mounting bracket to the steering cylinder literally exploded? (2d owner reporting the same thing) The mechanic who replaced it said it was mounted too low causing the cylinder to bind and it was just a matter of time before it failed. He shimmed the mounting bracket up about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch taking out the bind. Fiberglass dust in the ball joint didn't help either. You can't buy just the mounting bracket, you have to buy the entire assembly from Teleflex in Canada, $350+. biff@13-inc.com 8/00
Your Seastar Steering system is made by Teleflex, 604-270-6899
http://www.teleflexmarine.com/
http://www.teleflexmarine.com/steering-us/
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Common Information:
ZINCS, Zinc Saver, Bonding and Corrosion Control,
Click here to read the "Articles" section
To receive information from the Maxum Sports Yacht Owners Group
send your name, hull #, and tip, if you have one to James, @BilleGates@aol.com